Ep 49: Getting the most out of events with Nathan Spencer, Karen Willey and Ayo Abbas
Events and conferences are a big investment from both a financial and time perspective but also are a huge opportunity.
This episode is jam-packed with hints, tips and practical ideas about how you can make the most out of events so you harness them to get the most value.
As I’m off to UKREIIF in a few weeks, I’m speaking to Nathan Spencer, Director who is talking about how to get the most out of events from an exhibitor perspective. Then I interview BD expert Karen Willey from Always Thinking about how to get the most out of an event for business development. Finally, I do a deep dive into how to maximise your event presence before, during and after.
Resources and links
Find out about Abbas Marketing here
Check out Always Thinking’s website
Find out more on UKREIIF
Link to Karen’s MIPIM posts on LinkedIn
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Transcript.
Karen Willey 00:00
Ditch the pitch, you need to be yourself. You need to have fun, and you need to talk to people and make some genuine connections.
Ayo Abbas 00:14
Hello, and welcome to the latest episode of the Built Environment Marketing Show. I am your host, Ayo Abbas. I'm a marketing consultant and I work mainly with engineering and architecture firms on their marketing. Events and conferences are a big investment to take part in from both a financial perspective but also from a time perspective. I mean, having your stakeholders away for a week or so, is huge. So let's be honest, how do you get the most out of making such a big investment?
Ayo Abbas 00:46
In this episode, I'm talking to Nathan Spencer, who is the director for UKREIIF. And that's a new relatively new event that started last year in Leeds, and has grown massively this year. I think they've got over 6000 delegates already signed up and it's looking, if you look at the conference programme, it is impressive. So take a look at that as well. He'll be talking about, I guess, how to get the most out of a show from if you're, if you're an exhibitor or you're sponsoring a conference session. So really looking at it from that perspective. And then after that, I will also be chatting to Karen Willie, who is a BD expert, he's gonna very much talk about if you're going to a conference or a show, how do you get the most out of it as a visitor, as a delegate? How would you make sure that from a BD perspective, you are having those right conversations and in the right places, that's a fascinating chat that we have. And I know that there's so many takeaways that you'll get from that one. And then finally, I guess I'll give you my own take, I had a client who actually went to surface last year, and I did a lot of their marketing around that. And I kind of take a campaign based approach where you look at before, during and after the event. So you kind of look at it in three kind of separate areas. And you really build out a kind of comprehensive marketing campaign for that. So I'll be giving you some hints and tips on how to do that as well at the end. Anyway, I'll stop talking now and I'll let you get on with listening. First up we have Nathan Spencer from UKREIIF
Ayo Abbas 02:13
Hi, Nathan, thanks so much for coming on the show. So can you just give me a quick intro to who you are and your role at UK reef.
Nathan Spencer 02:20
Absolutely, So Nathan Spencer, one of the directors here at UKREIIF or actually built environment networking, who run UKREIIF. So, UKREIIF the UK is real estate investment and infrastructure Forum, which is why we need to call it UKREIIF
Ayo Abbas 02:34
because it rolls off the tongue.
Nathan Spencer 02:37
Yeah, its a long one. We did actually call it, typic when we were starting, which is, which was, can't remember what it was spelling, but actually two weeks into it registered trademark website said look, it's a tropical disease. So we really have load, shouldn't we the haste of getting it ready?
Ayo Abbas 03:00
Those great ideas, though. But now, look at you. It's all good. So you've got your show. And it's happening in just a few weeks time may, which isn't far from now. Quite scared. So may the 16th to 18th in Leeds. So it's a big conference and it's grown, big time, hasn't it from last year? Yeah. What's your numbers now?
Nathan Spencer 03:20
So the numbers were just ticking over about 6000 attendees, obviously, a few weeks ago, we see that number move forward last year, it was just about 4000 think it was like 3900 or so. So yeah, it's certainly increased quickly. Particularly, post pandemic is really important for event organisers to be seeing growth in events because it shows it's there, obviously was a bit of a struggle for us for a couple of years. But for every organisation like ours out there.
Ayo Abbas 03:47
And in terms of kind of that type of event, how does someone who's over, exhibiting or speaking or you know, taking part, how can they really get the most out of an event such as yours?
Nathan Spencer 03:58
Yeah, I suppose it differs on what their targets are. But don't be really defined in those from the beginning is what I would always say. So you need to know why you're there, what you want to get out of it, who you want to meet. We work with some of our partners very, very closely. Some of them who have got pavilions, which has their own sort of stage for three days. One of their key reasons is the alignment with what we're doing, you know, regeneration and include it in an inclusive, sustainable manner. They wanted to really get behind that. But then some of them are really fixated on we want to meet X, Y and Z. And actually that's where we can come in, you know, we've got a pretty big black book that we can go, well if you want to meet them. We can put on a panel discussion that's full focus on this sector, or this subject matter. And that helps bring those people in so they've got an hour of time on a panel or on a roundtable. So yeah, from my side, it's knowing what you're there for. And then you utilising both, you know, us as event organisers, because you're partnering with us, we're giving you our time and we will put that back in for you and then obviously going beyond that and trying to spot the opportunities yourself, which is where I suppose the business development element kicks in productivity, seeing where people are going to be making sure you're in that room at the same time.
Ayo Abbas 05:13
It's also how do you get the best guest lists? I said, that's a personal question.
Nathan Spencer 05:16
You need to know someone like me, just drop me a line. You know, there's so many times where there's all of these VIP events or inclusive of, you know, invite only, some of them in fairness, yes, they are invite only, there's 20 people in a room to have dinner. Yeah, it's gonna be difficult to get into their, my learning
Nathan Spencer 05:37
Just suddenly go bowling and go hi!
Nathan Spencer 05:39
Exactly, my experience will go into other events like this, whether it'd be a party conferences, whether it'd be certainly international events, like the one in the south of France. You just turn up and the person on the door, feels like they can't say no to you. So if you just go, oh, yeah, I've got, you know, I exchanged emails with somebody, the amount of times I've just been let into a room. And I'm like, there you go, that was easy, wasn't it? So I would be a bit cheeky a bit. Yeah, I'd go a little bit, you know, what's the worst that's gonna happen? If you really want to be in that room? What's the worst it's gonna happen? They'll tell you, sorry, your name's not on the list. So yeah, apart from knowing someone, but apart from that, just just rock up, see if you can get in.
Ayo Abbas 06:18
That's exactly the advice, the BD expert gave me Karen, exactly what it
Nathan Spencer 06:25
Genuinely is, it's open so many different doors for me where I like, well, I didn't think I'd be in that room with, with XYZ, so yeah, it's absolutely the place to go. But there are a lot of people in the industry, you know, everyone knows people. So you'll know someone who's going to that event. And even if you're just sort of tagged along with them, whatever it might be, you can get into a lot of sort of stuff like that, ya know, where you want to be, and to try to make sure that you get in it.
Ayo Abbas 06:52
So what's some of the kind of themes and topics that are being covered at the show?
Nathan Spencer 06:56
Themes or topics, so 2022, we had a really defined list of them. So it was inclusive investment, it was the net zero agenda. It was social value and it was the future of real estate, focused on not just tech, but also communities and the future of infrastructure, all that kind of stuff. We had some dedicated stages that focused on those areas. But actually, what we found this year is the events grown those who took those spaces last year JLL, Atkins, Pagabo, UK Business Council for Sustainable Development, they've they've continued to just do those conversations, but actually, they're not doing it on one topic, all of those seem to be integrated.
Ayo Abbas 07:33
They are aren't they, its all systemic now, isn't it?
Nathan Spencer 07:36
Yeah, you know, inclusive, inclusive, and sustainable regeneration, development, investment. You need all of those things to do it, right. So actually, it's just naturally the new partners who've got stages this year include Lloyds Bank, they include, who else are back again, cities like Newcastle, The West Yorkshire, London, Manchester, they've got their own
Ayo Abbas 08:01
But not Bury?
Nathan Spencer 08:04
Where sorry, Bury? Yeah. but it's the bury suite, top branding, isn't it? If they
Nathan Spencer 08:17
So yeah, we've had to change some of the wordings within the because it's a it's a museum. So some of the rooms are called really strange things. But yeah, the bury suite. That one is, effectively our main stage this year. So there's a load of content happening. And that's more of we've put the content on. And all of those subject matters are kind of branched out into, into different different periods during the three days. So yeah, the topics have really just kind of just navigated across everything we've got from logistics and shares to housing to Tech in buildings to community engagement. And one piece that we didn't have last year, we've got an EDI and youth pavilion, because we really wanted to have a stage which actually brought that out a little bit more like young people have a voice on stage, whereas the inaugural year that happens, but maybe not in, in kind of the abundancy that we were wanting to have
Ayo Abbas 09:08
Which sounds lovely, I mean I think giving giving a voice to the next generation is so so important, because just like we need to be inspired, and also to have the opportunities to talk right. I was just wondering, so in terms of, I have to admit I am loving the fact that stuff is back back in person, as we've will be locked up for how many years now? But I tell you what, I was looking through your event programme, which I think is brilliant, by the way. And I was like, but there's so much stuff at the same time that I want to see what can I do Nathan? And
Nathan Spencer 09:43
You can bring your siblings along. There's very little you could do. Unfortunately, it's one of navigating the programme and making sure you're in the right place at the at the right time for what you want. Yeah, there is a lot on I was I was surprised in 2022 With how much content there was, which was a similar amount of how sort of popular that sort of thing was, I thought it might have gone into more networking, but every stage was more or less full every single day. So there's obviously a desire for it. Yes, there is multiple things happening at numerous times. But yeah, potentially, that just leaves you with a follow up to go out to those people that you missed to go actually, I'm really sorry. Can we have a bit of a chat to talk me through? Because I unfortunately missed it?
Ayo Abbas 10:28
Yeah, I think there is that but I also think for me, event organiser, for the people who are running those stages, there is also a huge opportunity for them to either reuse that content, record it or do something more with it, because I think there is that thing, because even just looking at the programme, you're like, there is so much in there, yes, so much good content that you like, make sure you do use it more or share it in a different way. Because
Nathan Spencer 10:50
I agree,this is where it needs a you on their team, or your sales pitches, it's going to come up with a banner across the bottom now.
Ayo Abbas 10:58
I'd love to be here, but I can't.
Nathan Spencer 11:01
It is. And I think that it was a weird thing in 2022, when it first some of the organisation were really good at that. They recorded their onstage content, they have follow up pieces in an editorial form, they probably did podcasts or whatever else around it, while some of them just did it. And the three days is the three days. So yeah, it's probably a bit of a mixture, you're right, that content creator can branch out into so much. We've got people like estates Gazette and property week running their own content on stage. They're the types where you'll probably see that really well that it will be content but it will be free content, and it will be post content, as well as the at event piece. So yeah, following people like that, and how they do it at other events, as well as ours is probably a good model for other companies to be sort of having a look at because, yeah, we've got 20 odd stages, but then some of the stages, people are doing their own one hour slots. So there's so many there's 50 different organisations running content, which is it's great for us because it's diverse, different companies, different voices, different thoughts.
Ayo Abbas 12:08
Yeah, no, it's fantastic. It's just, it is just that thing of you can't clone yourself. And actually, there's so much good stuff there. You're like, how do you really make sure that you harness it as if you're taking part because I think that's the thing is like, it's a lot of work to go to any conference. And it's a lot of time and everything. I just think it's it's how to maximise that. So I always think, but yeah, I don't think there's that many people doing it that well yet, either. Like you said, I think the publications are.
Nathan Spencer 12:32
I agree on that. Yeah, I didn't see too much last year from from ours or from other events. A lot of it is embedding they've got a campaign and they use they've used ukreiif for an announcement, or it's a follow up to a report or whatever it might be. It's kind of part of them. Rather than it being a piece that then, you know, opens up their marketing campaign. So yeah, many doing different ways. But yeah, I think there's certainly, ways for for people to be improving that element of it.
Ayo Abbas 13:01
Okay, so what's your kind of, at the show? How can I guess a firm make the most of their presence there? Were there any kind of tips on that?
Nathan Spencer 13:10
How can who make their presence?.
Ayo Abbas 13:12
A firm, So if you're, if you're an exhibitor, or you're, you've got speakers there. So anything in particular, they could be doing?
Nathan Spencer 13:18
Yes, I suppose a lot of it is pre-planned activity. So working with those to make sure that we're putting XYZ in a room with you, without it being pre, it's a little bit more difficult, to then do it at the event, if you prepared and know what you're doing. And we've already set up those meetings or set up the content that's required, it's a little bit easier. But then certainly, I will be bringing down both a diverse group of individuals to the conference. That means that from our side, in particular, those people are always attracted to different things, and the outcomes will be much better and much stronger.
Nathan Spencer 13:55
I would then say to be having a team on the ground, that's marketing lead. So you've got somebody you know, we're open to people bringing down cameras, to doing interviews, to will connect people with certain individuals for a press piece. So the other day, someone rang me, law firm, and just said actually, can we bring down a camera? Someone with a camera? And could you introduce us to x y, or Z, three council leaders or chief execs or developers whatever it might be?
Ayo Abbas 14:23
Wow,that's such a great idea
Nathan Spencer 14:25
Exactly. It's perfect, be
Ayo Abbas 14:27
completely and then they've got what three little short snippets that they can share of, talking to the head of Bury council and they work with Bury council
Nathan Spencer 14:40
Perfect, their meeting, we can connect them with the right people, the right people, will want to talk because they want that sort of longevity to what they've done at UKREIIF being shared. It's a win win all round. They've got content, we've got content, the person in the interview has content. So yeah, it's just really little things like that. Just actually, that doesn't take them much, that will take them a couple of hours on one of the days to create that content.
Ayo Abbas 15:03
Someone's got to follow that camera crew around, but actually, they're going to meet the people they really want to meet. Exactly, yeah. And then you've got a reason to follow up after the event "Hi, we've got this" You know, it gives you
Nathan Spencer 15:13
Exactly what they want with their target. So yeah, those types of things. It's what we're very open to, we can be quite personal with the team that we've got in trying to connect the people into the right places. So yeah, businesses should be doing more stuff like that, I think.
Ayo Abbas 15:29
Yeah, no, that's brilliant. That's a brilliant example to use. Thank you for that. Okay, so I'm gonna ask you a question. No, it's so hard when it's just cheeky. So, what session are you most looking forward to at the event? just one question.
Nathan Spencer 15:49
Can I get one? Can I give three one each day?
Ayo Abbas 15:53
All right. day one,
Nathan Spencer 15:57
day one. Oliver Shah, who's the, who's the editor of The Sunday Times is doing a keynote on the mainstage, really good pulse on the industry? Yeah, I think that's going to be really interesting. For a piece perspective. Wednesday. We have Alastair Campbell and Rory Stewart, with a related Argent are working with us on that.
Ayo Abbas 16:22
That's a private event, because I looked at that I went that looks wicked.
Nathan Spencer 16:28
Yeah, and this is the area of facilitation says it's a related Argent want the room full of X Y, Z, I won't share the details of who they want in the room. But yeah, we can then work with them to do sort of private invitations to make sure that that audience is is there. But again, if it's 10 minutes into the talk, I'm pretty sure that you could just sort of sneak in at the back and stand up and watch. Yeah, that's what I'm really looking forward to. And then this is very regional based. So from a Leeds perspective, so within the EDI news pavilion, there's an event on in that evening. So there's, there was somebody called David, Allah Wiley, and a bridge has recently been built in his memory, in Leeds, and we've got a bit of a kind of a celebration to towards, sort of, his legacy. And, and a choir doing sort of a few songs towards the end of it. So yeah, that one, again, is something I think it sets us, sets it apart as a really different event, rather than it just being all focused on sort of build, build, build or infrastructure, infrastructure development. It's trying to bring different things into play.
Ayo Abbas 17:43
Fantastic. Glad I put you on the spot.
Nathan Spencer 17:48
I'm trying to say three different ones for every podcast or video or talk.
Ayo Abbas 17:53
Are you really?
Nathan Spencer 17:54
then everyone gets mentioned
Ayo Abbas 17:58
are you doing? I was like, Wow. Awesome. That is it. Thanks so much for coming on the show.
Nathan Spencer 18:04
Thank you very much for having me.
Ayo Abbas 18:09
Hi, it's Ayo here and I just wanted to tell you a bit more about the show. The Built Environment Marketing Show was set up during lockdown one as a way to help firms do better marketing. It was very much about having the conversations that I have with my friends and showing what best practice really is. In terms of me. Well, I'm actually a generalist marketeer. So I guess I know lots of things about marketing and how to put everything together. So I could be talking about you know, PR, or understanding what to do next strategy wise, or figuring out how to get in front of the right audience or what messaging you should be using. Those are all things that I'm kind of really skilled in and understand how to do for my clients. I now work for myself, and I set up my own consultancy, Abbas marketing in 2020. And I'm working with a range of engineering and architectural firms, and even prop tech firms who really want to, I guess, talk the language of their clients and their audiences and do something a bit different in terms of their strategy and content. If what I do sounds of interest to you do email me at Ayo@Abbasmarketing.com And there's A Y O or head to my website, which is www.abbasmarketing.com. For more info, there's also a link in the show notes bye.
Ayo Abbas 19:18
Hi, Karen, thanks so much for coming on to the show. Um, can you tell you a bit about yourself and what you do in terms of business development and also about your company Always thinking?
Karen Willey 19:32
I am Karen Willey. I am one of the C partners in Always Thinking, we are business development consultancy. I used to do business development for people. I think that is not a very good process. And actually what we decided was to do that we would teach people how to do business, not teach them, enable their businesses to do business development better. So that starts with really great processes, a really good understanding of your clients and upskilling your teams and having some really good strategies in place and knowing how have to approach things having all those tools to you had to hand that so that nothing's scary and everything's doable.
Ayo Abbas 20:05
I love that like making business development doable. That's actually really lovely. Because are built environment firms good at business development, or because I believe they're not. Is that true?
Karen Willey 20:18
I think traditionally, you're not because you don't you don't go through your training to become a business development person. So at no point during your architectural engineering degree, do they very rarely do they sit you down and go? Okay, so this is how you run a business. This is how you win work,
Ayo Abbas 20:33
the missing part, isn't it? Yeah,
Karen Willey 20:36
yeah. You know, and they, they really don't put that in. And therefore, you learn how to do your job well. And these are the soft skills, come along the way. So you sort of learn them by osmosis, or through accident, or because you want to have a good boss or things like that. And actually, what we're trying to do is to speed that, accelerate that process, because that can take a long time.
Ayo Abbas 20:59
And I think the other thing about the industry is we're all there fellow doers. So they're doing the work, but they're also selling the products and service. And I think that's a whole thing of you know, you're trained in technical excellence for your engineering, but actually your technical excellence on this kind of selling. Yeah, and this thing, isn't it
Karen Willey 21:15
completely. And also, what happens if you're a seller doer, what you do is you live in this cycle of this, up and down cycle, where you're like, I really busy, I've got to do all my work, oh, I'm not busy. Oh, I need some work. So you constantly live in this horrendous peak and trough, as the SAT. And so what we tried to do is show people how to be more focused, be more strategic, talk about the things that you do want to do, and how to then look at these sort of, so that you can keep doing it. Because the time you must do business development is when you're at your busiest. And that's the time when a lot of people will go, I don't need to do business development, we're really busy, we got work coming in left, right and centre.
Ayo Abbas 21:54
and then something happens and that work stops, and you're there going there's no pipeline.
Karen Willey 21:59
Yes. And that is the point. And that's the thing that we always say we say like when you're at your busiest that's when to invest, that's when to upskill the team, that's when to get more people doing it. You know, and that's, and that's the limitations around it. So yeah.
Ayo Abbas 22:12
the reason I kind of invited you on was because I love your tips, posts, which if you're not connected with Karen on LinkedIn, I advise you to look out because they were very funny ever had, because you made us laugh. I mean, they are very, very funny. But I will put a link into those in the shownotes. As it's conferences and and I'm going to leave shortly for UKREIIF, I thought it'd be good to kind of showcase some kind of business development tips for people who might be attending the show and wanting to network. So how should someone who is going to a conference or an in-person event, any tips on the kind of what prep they should be doing right now. So they get the most out of their time?
Karen Willey 22:50
Research. So you have to do your research, there is no point in going and rocking up and hoping for the best. So number one, and me and Katie, and this, this goes through all of business development any, before you do anything, research, the companies who are going.
Karen Willey 23:06
Who are your clients who are going, you need to know who's going. So if you've bought that ticket, which obviously one would hope you had, and you need to research it, you need to get on that database, and you need to find out who's going. And it's a slightly mundane task. But the benefits of it are really, really huge. Events are really good for targeting the people you want to work with who are there. But catching up with existing clients, and also finding new people, because there'll be other people on that list where you think, Oh, I've never heard of them before. That's interesting. I can see there's a synergy there. But that research and understanding their business, and understanding what they're doing there. And what they're trying to get out of it, it's the most, it's the most important thing you can do, because it makes everything else so much easier.
Ayo Abbas 23:48
So aside from the kind of delegate kind of list and that information directory, where else could you look?
Karen Willey 23:54
Speakers, all the speakers go and have a look on LinkedIn search UKREIIF on LinkedIn, if you're looking for architects put UKREIIF, all of those different things. Go to the news on Google, you know, don't just look at people's websites don't just look at their, go on Instagram, everybody's doing all of this stuff all the time now. So, they're all putting things out, we're going to you know, and everyone wants a full diary. And they're putting that out there because they want people to get in touch. So that's really important. So, looking on LinkedIn, but going beyond the usual search, you know, in using those hashtags, that's when a hashtag as nobody knows why they're putting a hashtag on something is really useful.
Ayo Abbas 24:34
And also Yeah, you could easily leave a comment on their post that they're going oh are you there, and also you can do your own posts on LinkedIn. I often do that I create some graphics. that say Hi I'm going to UKREIIF.
Karen Willey 24:45
pin tips were for us. It was a reason to show people that we were demonstrating we were going to nipin but doing it in a way that was not just the usual Hi we're going to
Ayo Abbas 24:56
Yeah, which actually gave you more traction didn't it? cuz it was fun.
Karen Willey 25:00
Yes, completely.
Ayo Abbas 25:03
So, I guess in some way, so coming, how would you connect with somebody beforehand? So, would you? So, you've done your research, you know, right, this is your target or the people you definitely want to connect with. Do you reach out beforehand? And how?
Karen Willey 25:16
Yes, you do. You can on LinkedIn, but often people don't respond unless they've put something up specifically to say they want to meet people. Yeah. Finding emails, the internet is a marvellous thing. You'd be surprised what you can find. You might already have them in your network, or, you know, but but buddying up with a few people who go, and we tend to buddy up a little bit. So we like, as well, it was well, as long side our clients, we also have people who, you know, like, "Oh, you're going, Oh, do you know them?" " Oh, I know them. Okay". You know, so that buddying up is really, really important. Also doing direct outreach. But then saying, like, "we're going it would be really great to catch up, we want to talk about, I'm not going to try and sell you this". But I can see you're doing this. I can see you want. You're talking about this, we're really interesting to talk about this.
Ayo Abbas 25:59
So not a generic connection. But it's more a, I know you're talking about this, or you're looking at such and such, I'd love to hear what you're doing. And this
Karen Willey 26:07
yes, or we've been doing that maybe we could have a conversation about this. You know, I'd like to introduce you to x, who's up there. Because I think there'd be a really good synergy there. You're looking for similarities and synergy. And that's why that research is really important. Yes, you can. You can carpet bomb, everybody. But really, you've ended up Why am I speaking to you? Wherever you are? And why am I speaking to you? Yeah, fancy coffee?
Ayo Abbas 26:35
Is it worth scheduling meetings and things like that for your calendar?
Karen Willey 26:38
Yes, because it gives you the security that you've got stuff to do. No one wants to walk around a conference, not having anything to do. So, schedule yourself into talks and schedule yourself meetings, but do leave free time as well, for those incidental things. So, there's, there's purposes, don't over schedule. do you know what I mean, because then otherwise, you'd be like, you might bump into somebody, they're like, Oh, we're just all gonna here for a drink.
Karen Willey 27:08
It's a fine balance of both people, you know, new people, and leaving a little bit of time just for those that you know, spontaneously, you know, serendipitous moments, as we like to call them.
Ayo Abbas 27:21
to call it now, because you've said for things like, quarter, quarter quarter, you know, like, actually, and then you've got free time in there is one of them.
Karen Willey 27:28
Yes, I would also take some time out for yourself as well. So yeah, it's really important. I mean, I'm a seasoned, like, you know, some people go back to their rooms and do yoga, some people just go off for a walk. But do just take a little bit of time to decompress and sort of reboot yourself as well. Even if you are a very gregarious out there person, you still need a little bit of time to think so hard. Like, you know what, I'm just gonna go sit in my room for 10 minutes and have a biscuit and
Ayo Abbas 27:54
just be quiet. Sometimes you're just like, I just want to sit down, I just want to be quiet. And that's it. And yeah, I find I, I always, I was having a chat the other day, it's like, I'm an extrovert introvert. So I've got both. And I can do it and then all sudden, like, I need to go now I need to I need to be quiet. I need to be alone. And and that's the thing is just acknowledging that and how you work, I think,
Karen Willey 28:14
yes, whether it's going for a run or stuff, like just all those things. They're all really, really useful. Definitely.
Ayo Abbas 28:19
Kind of how do you make sure you're on the right guestlist? And you're, you know, you're going to the parties that matter? I know you've got, obviously, yes, you have your network?
Karen Willey 28:28
Yes. That's when your network is critical. So you need to use your network, you need to talk to people, you know, you need to say what party have you been invited to? And then they'll go, oh, well, we've got this one. This one, this one? Well, you go well, I've got this one. This one this one? Can we do a little like party swap? Can you get me on that list? and I get you list? And then the other one is gatecrashed is also really good we've gate, over the years. I mean, we still do it now. We basically, get somebody in and then get them to like talk to somebody and then get lists or just walk up and pretend like you belong. You know, I am not down on the list? Oh, my gosh. Or going through the backdoor. I've also done that, but that's another story.
Ayo Abbas 29:20
I want to hear your stories now. Definitely.
Karen Willey 29:24
The party thinking it's gonna be really good. And then you bowl in thinking it's gonna be the best party ever. Oh, well, it's lets go.
Ayo Abbas 29:31
Talking of parties. I went to a party on Saturday, which was a launch of like, Adobe Express Firefly. Oh, it's like Adobe. I'm like, if you go to an event can I ask you, it's just a really important question. You go to an event and the guest list is first name. Do you think it's gonna be a good party or a bad party?
Karen Willey 29:49
Good.
Ayo Abbas 29:50
See, I always think event lists should be your last name. I always say when I go into an event, and it's the first name listed for the guest list, for me as someone who's organised event I'm like that means you're amateur. And to be honest, that was not arranged very well.
Karen Willey 30:04
Oh on first name terms oh as in like getting like alphabetised. Yeah, oh, so you are not in the W but you're in a K? Oh, yeah. Because as a W my life is really simple. I'm at the end, I am always at the end its very
Ayo Abbas 30:19
Abbas, I'm always first and then it's first name, I'm not!
Karen Willey 30:25
Yeah, where's Yeah, my name right in the middle, all my friends. My friends from like school and things are all people who like we're also at the my end of the register, because we used to stand around for ages waiting.
Ayo Abbas 30:35
your letterist basically that's what you are.
Karen Willey 30:38
because we were always last for everything, weren't we.
Ayo Abbas 30:43
My signal for something that doesn't work for an event Abbas managers always should be first? Okay. Okay, so right, I've made it all the way to UKREIIF, any other Show what do I need to do when I'm there? Apart from obviously go from my schedule?
Karen Willey 31:00
Yeah, what do you need to do, you need to ditch the pitch, you need to be yourself and you need to have fun. And you need to talk to people and make some genuine connections. And I think that's really, really that's some of the things that we always talk about, you're not, you're not there to sell, you're there to start to build relationships, business to business, essentially, is now up, there's the terminology, people to people, and actually what you're trying to do is move relationships on and create new ones and cement ones that you've maybe had for a long time. And that's the way to think about business development. Yes, there will be opportunities that will come out of those relationships, but focus on the relationship that you want with that person, if you're enjoying yourself with someone in you getting on with them. And you know what, just go with the flow, because that will stand you in so much better stead in the future than going right, I need to talk to 40 people if I haven't spoken to
Ayo Abbas 31:49
that's too much, but you know when someone's doing that.
Karen Willey 31:52
Exactly. Yeah. And it's really weird because some people look at them and go, Oh, that's so successful their working the room and everybody else is that there's that meh, no
Ayo Abbas 31:59
I delete as soon as that person comes into my inbox,, you'd be like, no.
Karen Willey 32:03
Really good conversations that you get or a night with somebody that you can follow up with, with really great things to, you know, move that relationship on, like I say, go from cold to really warm, go from warm to really, really hot, you know, and you don't I mean, so if you think about that, and the relationships that you want and do it that way. So go into it with that and just be really open to an opportunity to people and stuff. And we always say be interested and interesting.
Ayo Abbas 32:30
Yeah. Or is that curious conversations, isn't it and just being open and listening.
Karen Willey 32:35
Questions.
Ayo Abbas 32:36
Questions. Question. Chris do , I did a workshop last week with Chris do, who's I think is amazing. Yeah. Like, it was all about questions. How to propose, for pictures and stuff.
Karen Willey 32:47
what alot of people go to these things, they go with the things that they think they need to tell people? And we always say, no, no, no, go with the things you want to find out.
Ayo Abbas 32:58
And then that makes it a lot more interesting.
Karen Willey 32:59
And then life is so much easier, because you're not sitting there thinking, oh, I need to tell him that. And I need to say that. And I need to know all of this stuff. Just go in and say, go in with the questions and the things that you want to know about somebody. And then how you can feed that back into your business and all that and you'll have a much better time.
Ayo Abbas 33:14
At UKREIIF I've met some amazing people who have inspired me. Yeah, how do I remember them? Or how do I record stuff?
Karen Willey 33:22
Business cards and notes? Yeah, so if people give you a business card, make a note on it. 'No, never again.' 'Oh, my God'. 'Oh, yes. Yes, yes. Yes. Yes.'
Ayo Abbas 33:34
Any distinguishing features but that can be a bit offensive.
Karen Willey 33:38
Yeah, probably. and if it's not worth it. Just bin it, don't bring it home. Don't even worry about it. Leave it in the bin in the hotel or Airbnb. But if it's not covered in plastic, yeah, not never in front of anybody. I would also always say that, remember that everyone knows someone. So always, you know when I say not that one or no, unless they've been really offended. Really Be polite. Be nice. Like, you know, it's nice to be nice, just to be a good person.
Ayo Abbas 34:15
Okay, so shows down and back in London. Yeah. used to do.
Ayo Abbas 34:19
I think it might be blinq with a cue. I'm literally looking. Blinq
Karen Willey 34:19
So if you have a CRM. Oh, and also, I was gonna tell you about a little thing called Blinq. I don't know if you know about Blinq, that business card app. That's really good. Oh, that's really good. I've been blinq-ed a couple of times. I would definitely if you haven't got Yes. Is it blinc or blink? I can't spell it.
Karen Willey 34:42
Not very good for those who don't.
Karen Willey 34:45
Blink. It's Blinq.
Karen Willey 34:50
I'm gonna Blinq yer, I've been going around.
Ayo Abbas 34:52
So you've got the app on you know, you can scan your yes your QR code can't you which I think is brilliant as well. That's Those two things
Karen Willey 35:00
are great. And if you don't have business cards, it's also really good because you can just go, Oh, I'll send you an email. Now. I think you put the subject line of 'chat in a bar' 'Man who likes beer' or you know, woman who loves
Ayo Abbas 35:11
Actually, I like that. That's really good.
Karen Willey 35:14
Straight away. Because the conversation you've had you capture it in the subject, and you send it.
Ayo Abbas 35:20
Record, that's your record as well. Right.
Karen Willey 35:22
So there's, that's always another way Oh, phone out with you. But that's always just just straight away, do the email exchange. That's brilliant.
Ayo Abbas 35:29
Okay, so I think that is it for our questions. Thank you.
Karen Willey 35:33
The only thing I would say is when you're back, you did say one more thing when you back, follow up. And make the subject line really interesting. No draw subject lines here.
Ayo Abbas 35:44
So, what is an interesting subject line? Tell me more,
Karen Willey 35:46
the one that we were talking about, let's say i Oh, we were talking about, I don't know, our children and boys and the amount of distance they can run? Yeah. So I would be the subject would be I'd write the email, then I'd look back and think, Oh, the distance boys run, you know, and that would be Oh, so
Ayo Abbas 36:02
it would stand out in your inbox, rather than go
Karen Willey 36:03
Introduction to Karen, you know, always thinking follow up, blah, blah, blah, you know, or if we spoke about food, and we said, we were gonna go somewhere, put some dates and times in for where we're going to go for the food and put the title in the food. We love. Just that stuff. It makes it more personal.
Ayo Abbas 36:20
and make it human, because then you can kind of feel the relationship and really enjoy it.
Karen Willey 36:25
Yeah, and have a bit of fun with it.
Ayo Abbas 36:29
Networking fun?
Karen Willey 36:30
No one thinks it's fun. But I think that's also the thing, right? No one actually went really enjoys it. So straightaway, we always say there's your icebreaker. Yeah. Oh, my God, I hate. It's like, you don't need to go anywhere. It's like the weather or COVID. It's a common, is the easiest. What you need to do is find the easiest thing that makes you a collective and the commonality of network is that no one really likes it. Yeah. So there you go. So there's a common thread. And that's how to do it.
Ayo Abbas 36:55
And actually, if you're that one who makes it fun, then do remember you because you're like, actually had a really lovely time. It's like, yeah, really
Karen Willey 37:03
do speak to a few people, we all say act like the host. pretend. So even if it's not your, you know, introduce people to other people take them for a drink. Like, just you'll have much more fun, and people will really enjoy it. So don't worry about breaking into conversations, worry about how you are, presenting. You know what I mean? The only person you can deal with is you. Yeah, I cannot make everybody in the room act in a different way or let me into their conversation. But what I can do is I can stand there with a bloody great big smile on my face and look like it might be fun if you Yeah, and then if someone's giving their own go over and go "Hello!"
Karen Willey 37:45
Let's get some food and a drink.That's all you know, it is like that age old adage, isn't it? Like, don't worry about everybody else. Just worry about yourself in a weird way. But then, and then going with the questions. Don't, ditch, the all that stuff. Just go in, ooo your interesting.. Yeah. Oh, wait. Party. Can I come with you? Oh, the places you go.
Ayo Abbas 37:53
Anyway, on that lovely note, thank you so much being an awesome guest. And for your tips? Yeah, I'm looking forward to UKREIIF, thank you.
Karen Willey 38:17
Let us know how it goes, I will be very excited to hear how it goes.
Ayo Abbas 38:20
So how do you get the most out of an industry event or exhibition? I think for me, one of the key things that you really do need to have is energy and excitement. How do you create that it's not something that just happens at the show, it's something you've got to work up. And really in the run-up to an event, you've got to do what you've got to do kind of before, during, and after.
Ayo Abbas 38:48
So pre event, at the event and post event. So there's lots and lots of things you need to do and to think about. I'm going to take it as given that you've actually got something exciting to do, Launch or say, at the show.
Ayo Abbas 38:51
Let's assume that you have because I think you have to kind of find something definitely. So this case is going to look at how you kind of bring energy and excitement around your presence of being somewhere.
Ayo Abbas 39:12
So firstly, for me pre-event, how do you raise your visibility on social media? think about how you can be a part of that conversation right from the start. You need to make sure that you're posting and sharing where you'll be, your stand number, who's going to be there from your organisation. So really, kind of make sure that you're in the conversation. Find out what the show hashtags and tags are, and use those in your posts that you again reach more people who are actually talking about the show, enthused about the show and go into the show. And you know, when it comes to things that you can share, you can share about what you're gonna be showing, you can do teasers. You can talk about a talk that you'll be giving, you can talk about how you're prepping for it. You can share you know, little kind of hints and tips about what your Stand's gonna be like or whatever. but you can do those kinds of little things just to build up some momentum and some excitement about you going to be somewhere.
Ayo Abbas 40:07
Another thing that you can do pre event is actually looking to kind of the press and the media that are going, who can you meet at the show? Are you going to, kind of, prepare a, kind of, media release? who's going to be writing features about the show that you can, kind of, connect with beforehand and share information with, if you've got a new product launch, for example, or service launch? Who can you kind of share that information with? Have you got, like a whole media pack ready to go? Have you got quotes in that, kind of, press release that are, kind of, you know, from your key people that are easy to pull out. So there's lots you can do around the media, in terms of making sure that you've got visibility, and let people know that you're going to be there, but also that you're going to, you know, a lot of the kind of previews and stuff I've done beforehand.
Ayo Abbas 40:47
So actually connecting and getting the word out that you're going to be about, show, it's another opportunity for you to raise your visibility, they think in terms of building energy and excitement, it's getting your kind of message and who you are, and that you're going to be there out there. And with enthusiasm, just getting it out there as much as you can so press previews are another way you can do that. I think another thing you can do pre-event is also is actually maximise all promotional opportunities.
Ayo Abbas 41:14
So some shows might do things like spotlights on innovation, spotlight some new services or new products. So making sure that you tap into that as well, speak to the organisers find out what's going on, what things can you tap into, or provide or help or be a part of, before the actual show, some of these might have a long lead time in terms of deadlines. So just looking out for them and making sure that you're in there, so you really maximise any investment you've got that you're making to kind of be at a show.
Ayo Abbas 41:42
And I think the other thing that you should do pre-event is email, your existing contact list. Those people who you haven't kind of necessarily engaged with all the time, but they know you and they're your contacts, and kind of just say, you know, Hi, we're going to be there, you know, good chance to re reconnect, this is what you might be interested in. So again, it's about kind of using that and using, you know, the show as a hook, as an opportunity to reconnect with those people who already do business with you. And I think as well, you've got things like having banners on your website, having banners on your email, just saying you're going to be there, as well as your key people also posted on LinkedIn that they will be there. So it's a way you can kind of build up that pre-event hype, and make sure that you are going to maximise your time at that show when it does happen.
Ayo Abbas 42:28
Okay, now we've looked at pre-event, what's going to happen at the show. So for me, one of the kind of Holy Grails is encouraging user generated content, as I call it, which is like the proper marketing term, UGC. That's basically when a third party shares about you or your product or service. And to me, that's the most powerful type of marketing. So it was a journalist, if it's, if it's a, you know, a potential client, or just saying, I'm on this stand, I met this person, I went to this talk, it was brilliant, this is what they said. And I kind of think it's that third party endorsement, we trust others, probably more than we trust the firm. So actually, it's quite nice to have people sharing their experiences of you, your stand your people, your talk, you know, encourage people to take pictures, encourage them to share what they see, you know, be part of the conversation. And I think the other thing is, if people are sharing your content on social media, thank them in DM'S afterwards, thanks so much for sharing, continue the conversation, start to have that two-way dialogue, which is what you want as a fan.
Ayo Abbas 43:30
So, so important. And again, it helps build up momentum, it helps build up your social media presence, it also helps you build relationships with those people, one to one, which ultimately is what you want from being at an exhibition, how can you move that conversation on post-event? How do you build a relationship? How do you start a conversation. And again, I think also, with social media, it's having some posts that you put out during the show, so prepping those before the events before the event, you've got lots more visibility, making sure you're posting regularly, at the event, have regular posts for each day that you're going to be there that kind of stop posting, you know, just go up, as well as showing stuff, you know, you can create more on the fly. But at least having a baseline of stuff that's ready to go will really make sure that your presence is there and you have your visibility. Or it might even be sometimes what I'll do is I'll draft the post, but actually take pictures at the show. So, it's just making it easy. So, you do definitely get your social media presence going. And also, I think at the show is having somebody who is dedicated to your social media feed to actually keep that going and keep the momentum going there. And I think the other thing about shows, you know, Nathan talking about UKREIIF was very much talking about there's lots of the fringe events, launch events, people with offices doing lots of stuff all around the shows. So again, it's about connecting with people beforehand, finding out what's going on at the show, and making sure you're there so you've got people at the launches, the industry breakfast. So you're part of the conversation part of the event. And again, just I guess, sweating the asset of being at that event.
Ayo Abbas 45:04
And I think the final thing when you're at a show, as well as doing something different, so it could be a competition or a giveaway could be, you know, some people have done mind maps, at shows which I've seen, which are amazing. You've got things like sketches, just different ways of bringing people and bringing some excitement to your stand and making your presence and stand out. So I think, again, it's about thinking about your stand, and how you can kind of do something different, that drives traffic to your stand, and makes you stand out.
Ayo Abbas 45:33
And now on to post-event, is a really kind of, it's one of those things, I think people kind of lose steam on. And I think it's a real missed opportunity. And to me, I think it's really easy to kind of get to the end of a show and think I'm done. Don't want to do this for another year. But really, the most important thing you can do is actually post-event follow-up. Because that is really where you start to pull the relationships and start to get real value from your presence. And I think anything that you can do before the show actually starts, you know, and you can prepare for post-event will make it far easier for you to respond once the show is done. Because quite frankly, you're going to be pretty tired, and you're going to have had enough. So for me post events, you know, follow-up, needs to be planned and ready before the event to figure out what is your follow up going to be before the show.
Ayo Abbas 46:26
So you know, are you sending out samples? Or you're arranging meetings? Will you be picking CPD presentations? What is it you're going to do following follow up after the event, have all of that kind of mapped out and fought out, draft those kind of any post event holding emails, or any responses that you need to do draft them before you even go to the show. So you've got everything ready to go. So it's literally Top and Tail, just you know, amend it slightly, maybe drop in an odd image, but more or less, it's ready to go. That means that you are quick to act after the event. And I think that's the thing that people expect is like if you leave it weeks and weeks after, that leads gone cold. So what you want to be able to do is respond. "Hi, it was great to meet you on such and such. I'll be in touch Next week we what we discussed", even just a simple holding email, like that would be something. But I think it's just that whole, making sure that you've got your follow up planned. And also, I think the other thing is to measure the kind of post event, make sure you measure the return on investment. What was the impact of the overall kind of campaign that you did? Was there you know, around up well, you know, did the website traffic go up? Did social media traffic go up? What happened? Who mentioned you? Did you get any starts trying to connect with firms that you've been targeting all across the year, that really kind of helped you in terms of leads and ultimately in terms of sales. So making sure you track and kind of measure the impact of you being at that show? Or you know, also you want to kind of see if there's any certain spikes from you kind of being at the show? Was it did it bring you real value. Did it meet your original objectives and goals, to try and understand really how that event or that conference or that talk, how it really added value to you. Anyway, those are some of my tips on how what to do in terms of an event before, during and after. And also thanks to my guests David and Karen. And I hope that you found this episode really useful. Thank you. Bye
Ayo Abbas 48:27
Thanks so much for listening to the built environment marketing show. Don't forget to check out the show notes which will have useful links and resources connected to this episode. You can find that on Abassmarketing.com And of course if you liked the show, please do share it with others on social as it helps more people to find us. See you soon.
